Push vs Pull

Fri Mar 3 11:38:40 UTC 2006

Robin, thanks again for your kindness and your time!!!   :-)   :-)   :-)

I am copying to related list (Yadis, IDgang, VP Symposium) your kind and
generous contribution (the latest corrected VP constitutional amendment
English version):

 =============================
(*) Proposed Virtual Personality fundamental/human right
"Every person has the right to have or not to have a virtual personality,
where its presence, content and projection is regulated by each one of
them.

It can not be used for discriminatory ends harming its bearer.

The State will guarantee that the information included in the virtual
personality have the adequate juridical and technical security; with the
exclusion of an unauthorised third party trying to obtain it.
 The State could use the content of the virtual personality of the person,
previous authorization of the person, and always just if it is in the
benefit and advantage of the person."
=======================

On 3/3/06, Robin Wilton <Robin.Wilton at sun.com> wrote:
>
> Jaco, by the way, one other comment (and apologies if we already
> discussed this when I was trying to translate the original clauses
> into English): the word 'pretend' is much more commonly used in
> English to mean 'simular/fingir' than 'pretender'.
>
> So when you say "an unauthorised third party who pretends to obtain it',
> the most common interpretation would be in the sense of
> "quien finge obtener los datos". (I hope I've written that correctly!!)
>
> Yrs.,
> Robin
>
>
> Jaco Aizenman wrote:
>
> Dick, Joaquin, Drummond and all,
>
> My interest and contribution is less on the technical aspects and more on
> the metasystem or human/fundamental rights aspects(*).
>
> So since (*), read below...(*), specifies that every person can regulate
> his virtual personality, my question is if it is possible for a  metasystem
> to have both...?, and for every person to choose when using them...?.
>
> Thank you for your time!.            :-)
>
> =============================
> (*) Proposed Virtual Personality fundamental/human right
> "Every person has the right to have or not to have a virtual personality,
> where its presence, content and projection is regulated by each one of
> them.
>
> It can not be used for discriminatory ends harming its bearer.
>
> The State will guarantee that the information included in the virtual
> personality have the adequate juridical and technical security; with the
> exclusion of third parties not authorized that pretend to obtain it.
>  The State could use the content of the virtual personality of the person,
> previous authorization of the person, and always just if it is in the
> benefit and advantage of the person."
> =======================
>
> On 3/2/06, Dick Hardt <dick at sxip.com> wrote:
> >
> >  Joaquin
> >
> >  Here is my clarification between Push and Pull:
> >
> >  Pull:
> >  - The user provides the Relying Party with a *user unique* Repository
> > locator. (URL or XRI)
> >  - The Relying Party queries a Repository to get user data.
> >  - The user may or may not be involved in the transaction.
> >
> >  I consider OpenID, LID and XRI Pull architectures
> >
> >
> >  Push:
> >  - The Relying party advertises what data it wants.
> >  - The user "Pushes" the data to the Relying Party
> >  - The repository does not need to be accessible to the Relying Party.
> > This allows the data to reside on the user's machine.
> >  I consider Shiboleth, SXIP and WS-* Push architectures
> >
> >  ....
> >
> >  With SXIP, which is a Push architecture, we have a need for protocol
> > discovery, which lead to my interest in Yadis. Unlike the Pull technologies
> > where the identifier is for the user, the identifier was for the user agent
> > so that the Relying Party would know what the user agent was capable of.
> > This is only needed for zero desktop footprint implementations. Rich Clients
> > would be able to negotiate capabilities with the Relying Party.
> >
> >  The original Yadis mandate was for identity protocol discovery. I was
> > very interested in leveraging existing work, if it did not impose excessive
> > overhead. The current direction of Yadis seems to be exclusively for support
> > of the Pull technologies.
> >
> >  Feel free to ask for any clarifications.
> >
> >  -- Dick
> >
> >
> >   On 2-Mar-06, at 4:38 PM, Joaquin Miller wrote:
> >
> >  This might be right (someone who uses the terms might could explain
> > them)
> >
> > and it is certainly clear, which is very useful.
> >
> > Okay, let me see if I have this Push/Pull distinction straight.  Please
> > correct me if I'm wrong.
> >
> > "Pull" protocols are those that put some data out there to be accessible
> > via a URL.  The data does not change based on who requests the information.
> > Yadis is such a protocol, since when an Relying Party goes to fetch the
> > data, there is no specified way to change the data based on who is
> > requesting it.
> >
> > "Push" protocols are those that allow the user to modify the data based
> > on who is requesting it.  OpenID is such a protocol: the data is transmitted
> > by redirecting the user between the Relying Party and the Identity Provider,
> > and the user can choose to have the Identity Provider send his or her
> > authentication information or to cancel the transaction.
> >
> > Is that right, or is there something I'm missing?
> >
> >
> > If this is what 'push' and 'pull' mean, then your examples are certainly
> > right:  According to your distinction Yadis is pull and OpenID and LID are
> > push.  LID, of course, differs from OpenID; you describe OpenID in your
> > example of push.
> >
> > Cordially, Joaquin
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jaco Aizenman L.
> My iname is =jaco (http://xri.net/=jaco)
> Virtual Rights Institute - Founder www.virtualrights.org
> XDI Board member - www.xdi.org
> Tel/Voicemail: 506-3887222
> Costa Rica
>
> What is an i-name?
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-name
>
>
>

--
Jaco Aizenman L.
My iname is =jaco (http://xri.net/=jaco)
Virtual Rights Institute - Founder www.virtualrights.org
XDI Board member - www.xdi.org
Tel/Voicemail: 506-3887222
Costa Rica

What is an i-name?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-name
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